Dynasty Draft Orders


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    Location : Grandville, MI
    Registration date : 2007-11-30

    Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Vriez on Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:40 am

    Hey I had a random question about some of the other leagues you guys are in....

    I just took over a team in another dynasty. Its their second year as well, and there is a little squabble about draft order. The MiLB draft is set to be serpentine, but a couple of the guys are complaining that it should be reverse order (meaning the last place team selects first for every round and that order is kept throughout). His argument is that in dynasty or keeper leagues, its STANDARD that the draft is reverse order to uphold balance of talent...and that its "only fair." The league is pretty much split down the middle on the decision and one of the guys (not me) is getting pretty vicious about it.

    I was wondering if you guys have heard or upheld the "standard" that keeper/dynasty drafts be reverse order. Everything Ive ever done has been serpentine. The guy brings up a valid point, I guess, but in only a 12 team league...if anyone gets the #1 in every round, its a pretty strong advantage. Seems like it would swing the power on a yearly basis.

    Appreciate any opinions. Thanks.

    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Guest on Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:53 am

    i decided a long time ago that "snake" drafts weren't fair, in fact, I went so far as to develope a "sliding snake" draft where your position changed every round, either falling down or sliding up depending on whether the round was even or odd numbered. It was awesome, and I thought, fair, since almost every team got to have back-to-back picks and every team got to pick both at the beginnings *and* end of rounds depending on where we were in the draft. Of course, some people got confused with it and hated the uncertainty of when they 'picked--even though i'd submit the entire draft order ahead of time. But as far as creating equity amongst the teams in regards to draft value, as well as preventing the teams from either end the ability to dictate the draft with their picks, it was a smashing success.

    That said, most internet league hosting sites are set up for snake drafts, and only snake drafts. Snake drafts are ultra simple to administer and to understand. What the other guys in your new leauge, the anti-snake guys are suggesting would *punish* the successful teams, at least theoretically. I think the key is to assign ever pick a value, like in our draft the first pick was either worth 120 points or 1 point depending on how you want to do it. At the end of the first two round in a regular snake draft both the team who picked first in the first round and the team who picked last in the first round will the same "value" of picks...in an anti-snake draft the difference is substantial and will continue to grow over the course of the draft.

    Finally, I do believe in helping the weaker teams get competitive, but at the same time I wonder if they wouldn't be better served by actually figuring out how to draft/trade/free agent claim better. This isn't the banking industry, where who you know and where you went to school can play a major part in your success, this is soley dependent on how well you play the game, and if you aren't cutting the mustard, then I think your only reward should be the first pick in every odd round, not every round. Why punish the teams who take care of business, uneccessarily?

    ps. what happened to spellcheck on this thing?

    Number of posts : 475
    Age : 36
    Location : Grandville, MI
    Registration date : 2007-11-30

    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Vriez on Thu Feb 26, 2009 9:23 am

    Thanks E.

    Your last paragraph (not counting the spellcheck comment) was exactly my point during the argument...but I think you stated it much better than I did. I also think that your point system could help drive the point home.

    Do you have a quick breakdown of your sliding snake format? I just grabbed a piece of paper and tried to sketch out how it would work, but I cant get it very fair.

    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Guest on Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:07 pm

    It's basically moving the team picking first in an odd round to the back of the line in the following odd round, and then reverse order mirroring (ala a snake draft) with even rounds. Bear in mind that my principal concern was two teams (and really only those two teams) being able to cause runs with their selections, thus "dictating" how the draft flowed. I also think, however, that it is more "fair" to all of the teams. Here's a breakdown of how the first six rounds of a ten team draft would look like:

    1.01 Team A
    1.02 Team B
    1.03 Team C
    1.04 Team D
    1.05 Team E
    1.06 Team F
    1.07 Team G
    1.08 Tean H
    1.09 Team I
    1.10 Team J

    2.01 Team J
    2.02 Team I
    2.03 Team H
    2.04 Team G
    2.05 Team F
    2.06 Team E
    2.07 Team D
    2.08 Team C
    2.09 Team B
    2.10 Team A

    Same as a snake draft to start, but then you move Team A to the back of the line

    3.01 Team B
    3.02 Team C
    3.03 Team D
    3.04 Team E
    3.05 Team F
    3.06 Team G
    3.07 Team H
    3.08 Team I
    3.09 Team J
    3.10 Team A

    4.01 Team A
    4.02 Team J
    4.03 Team I
    4.04 Team H
    4.05 Team G
    4.06 Team F
    4.07 Team E
    4.08 Team D
    4.09 Team C
    4.10 Team B

    Here's where people would start crabbing, especially Team A, but the team still gets the same number of back to back picks they would have had in a regular snake draft. Now, however, Team B also gets the first pick in a round and after picking last in the subsequent two rounds, will finish out with back to back picks...which he would never had seen in a regular snake draft

    5.01 Team C
    5.02 Team D
    5.03 Team E
    5.04 Team F
    5.05 Team G
    5.06 Team H
    5.07 Team I
    5.08 Team J
    5.09 Team A
    5.10 Team B

    6.01 Team B
    6.02 Team A
    6.03 Team J
    6.04 Team I
    6.05 Team H
    6.06 Team G
    6.07 Team F
    6.08 Team E
    6.09 Team D
    6.10 Team C

    and so on and so forth...this might also be an easy way to get the pertinent info (having screwed it up many time myself, let me remind you that odd rounds are ascending and even--reverse-ordered mirrored--rounds are descending):

    Round 1 [A-J], Round 2 [J-A]
    Round 3 [B-A], Round 4 [A-B] {3: BCDEFGHIJA, 4: AJIHGFEDCB}
    Round 5 [C-B], Round 6 [B-C]
    Round 7 [D-C], Round 8 [C-D]
    Round 9 [E-D], Round 10 [D-E]
    Round 11 [F-E], Round 12 [E-F]
    Round 13 [G-F], Round 14 [F-G]
    Round 15 [H-G], Round 16 [G-H]
    Round 17 [I-H], Round 18 [H-I]
    Round 19 [J-I], Round 20 [I-J]
    Round 21 it starts all over again from the beginning

    At the end of twenty rounds, every team has picked first in a round, picked last in two consecutive rounds and then has two back-to-back picks. I'll leave it to the mathematicians amongst us to figure out if it really is more equitable for all teams, but I think it works great. Pick a team at random and then write down what their selections are in each round, it'll give you a clear picture of both the slide and why I think it's a better system. Hope this is helpful.
    Chris Glowa
    Chris Glowa
    General Manager

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    Registration date : 2007-12-01

    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Chris Glowa on Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:54 pm

    I honestly think that format works better for fantasy football since the top few picks are generally much more "safe" compared to the rest of the first and second round. Therefore the guy who drafts Adrian Peterson first overall has a slightly more level playing field since they have to pick last in the 3rd round instead of first.

    For baseball, I prefer the standard snake since there's much less risk in the first three rounds of a 10-12 team league.

    It sounds like the guy in your league is looking to rebuilt the "easy way." That doesn't really sound fair to the teams that have been built in a thoughtful manner.

    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Guest on Thu Feb 26, 2009 4:08 pm


    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Guest on Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:13 pm

    I will never succumb to that silly sliding serpentine crap...boulderdash I say...

    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Guest on Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:25 pm

    dude, you've bitching about that shit for how many years now?

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    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by remysox on Sun Mar 08, 2009 12:48 pm

    i've got a sliding snake for ya!

    Re: Dynasty Draft Orders

    Post by Guest on Sun Mar 08, 2009 4:49 pm

    E...some of your posts would qualify as novellas...how do you find the time? LOL

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